Author Topic: Ares 1X  (Read 86032 times)

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #150 on: January 31, 2010, 10:02:00 PM »
I don't want to speculate what Obama will do in either case. I think that I don't have the necessary tools to do that. I just broke the news about Obama's Admin's decision on NASA's future.

I know only one thing - if he will have this double failure, failing to pass the Health Reform AND failure to pass his NASA decisions, he will have a tough time ahead, at least politically.

What will he do in this case? Your guess I think, is as good as mine.

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spaceboy7441

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #151 on: February 03, 2010, 04:56:52 AM »
Well this was a waste. Nice to see rocket launches and see it implemented into SSM but there is now no reason for the flight
Cancelled
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Moonwalker

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #152 on: February 07, 2010, 08:38:58 PM »
Nice to see rocket launches and see it implemented into SSM but there is now no reason for the flight

There is: excitement. It still was an amazing launch. The great work of the SSM2007 crew was not for nothing. History is not "cancelable" ;)

And keep in mind that the results of that flight and its preparations will have an impact on future designs (especially wiser decisions...).

spaceboy7441

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #153 on: February 07, 2010, 09:12:05 PM »
Nice to see rocket launches and see it implemented into SSM but there is now no reason for the flight

There is: excitement. It still was an amazing launch. The great work of the SSM2007 crew was not for nothing. History is not "cancelable" ;)

And keep in mind that the results of that flight and its preparations will have an impact on future designs (especially wiser decisions...).
I was not saying there was no reason for SSM to implement it. I was saying there is now no need for the results. Ares 1 is DEAD. You can not use the results for that flight for another rocket. And we will be going commercial so they already have their own rockets.
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Moonwalker

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #154 on: February 07, 2010, 09:25:23 PM »
I was not saying there was no reason for SSM to implement it. I was saying there is now no need for the results. Ares 1 is DEAD. You can not use the results for that flight for another rocket. And we will be going commercial so they already have their own rockets.

Yes. Ares 1 is dead (but work still continues until its current budget will be exhausted). But NASA won't stop developing rockets and using SRB's in future just because Ares 1 is canceled. That's why Norman Augustine mentioned the importance and suggested to perform the Ares 1-X flight even if Ares 1 won't ever fly. Because the test flight is an engineering benefit for future developments. A lot of aerodynamic and rocketry data has been collected related to single SRB usage.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2010, 09:27:04 PM by Moonwalker »

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #155 on: February 07, 2010, 10:14:45 PM »
Nice to see rocket launches and see it implemented into SSM but there is now no reason for the flight

There is: excitement. It still was an amazing launch. The great work of the SSM2007 crew was not for nothing. History is not "cancelable" ;)

And keep in mind that the results of that flight and its preparations will have an impact on future designs (especially wiser decisions...).
I was not saying there was no reason for SSM to implement it. I was saying there is now no need for the results. Ares 1 is DEAD. You can not use the results for that flight for another rocket. And we will be going commercial so they already have their own rockets.

Spaceboy7441,

Don't forget that the Ares I-X test launch was the culmination of years of planning, testing, simulating, developing methodologies, policies and standards, experimenting with materials, learning and manufacturing. The accumulated benefit of all these is immense!

The test launch and the tons of measurements they took from the actual event, the experience the team got from actually building Ares I-X are useful and priceless for the future of Space Exploration - regardless whether it is done by NASA or by other "entity".

So that short 6+ minutes sub-orbital ride, packs the punch of tens of thousands of people behind it, their knowledge, experience, dreams, aspirations and professionalism - we should NEVER underestimate that!

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gablau

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #156 on: February 10, 2010, 08:14:07 PM »
The American manned space program is dead for now. Ares-1 is canceled, not even valid replacement for an Earth-ISS back and forth mission possibility, not even as much as the Soyuz.

Make sure that you make at least one DVD of SSM 2007, unused and sealed, with some laptop to load it on, and leave it to your great-grandchild. It will be a heck of a collectors value :)

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #157 on: February 10, 2010, 08:18:02 PM »
The American manned space program is dead for now. Ares-1 is canceled, not even valid replacement for an Earth-ISS back and forth mission possibility, not even as much as the Soyuz.

Make sure that you make at least one DVD of SSM 2007, unused and sealed, with some laptop to load it on, and leave it to your great-grandchild. It will be a heck of a collectors value :)

:)

Yes, it will be the FIRST release of a (hopefully) long franchise. Definitely a collector's item.

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Moonwalker

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #158 on: February 11, 2010, 03:35:31 PM »
Just like Ares 1, Orion also won't be in memory as a glory achievement:

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2010/02/unlucky-orion-crashing-space-program-drop-test-fails/

The situation is quite sad. NASA won't only have a launcher, they won't even have a crew vehicle at all. They will have exactly: nothing. And that for the very first time within its history. NASA won't get into space on its own for more than a decade. So people should realize why we need commerical companies to back up agencies.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2010, 03:48:21 PM by Moonwalker »

bjbeard

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #159 on: February 14, 2010, 11:20:46 AM »
This makes me ashamed to be American...


I shall call myself a Confederate from now on... How about putting a if of the first national Confederate flag in the avatars? No not that battle flag everyone has a thing about, but the star and bars?


This sucks...

Moonwalker

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #160 on: February 14, 2010, 05:59:22 PM »
You have a reason to be proud of being American, bjbeard. SpaceX is the first company in the world that launches rockets into LEO. They have even put a small satellite into LEO with their Falcon 1.

Watch this in 720p HD and full screen and you certainly will be amazed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmkP6GySJe0

This is only the very beginning of commercial human space flight. The Flacon 9 launch window will start in early March, so not even one month from now ;)


Pocci

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #161 on: February 14, 2010, 10:52:14 PM »
Interesting, in this video there is a launch escape tower. If you go to their website you will not find that.
http://www.spacex.com/

Inaugural flight launch window will start in early March?
Hmm, they say "We expect to launch in one to three months after completing full vehicle integration" and they just initiated vehicle integration. I don't know how long is takes to fully integrate the vehicle, but add one month and launch would definitely not be in early march.

Their launch manifest still indicates 2009 as target date. Not very actual and not very precise. And what is the meaning of "Target date indicates hardware arrival at launch site"? ::)
I expect a date on a launch manifest as the day where the hardware is leaving launch site.  ;D

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Coordinator of 1st multiplayer Launch on 2009-05-30

Moonwalker

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #162 on: February 15, 2010, 01:12:55 AM »
The crew escape system will be part of the manned Dragon capsule only. The cargo version won't use a crew escape system of course. The qualification vehicle also won't use one. It is the first vehicle which will be used for testing. It's already prepared to go fly:





Although behind schedule (as usual in space flight mostly), both, Falcon 9 first and second stages have passed full duration and orbit insertion simulation tests successfully. The launch of Falcon 9 now depends on integration, weather and on NASA also. It's already a joint venture between SpaceX and NASA. The launch of Falcon 9 will earn at least as much attention and excitement as Ares 1-X. It certainly will become breaking news once lifted off and reached orbit. For now there is nothing closer to human transportation to the ISS than SpaceX. Not NASA nor ESA is closer. Sad but we at least have something to hope on ;)

For launch schedules visit:

http://www.webcitation.org/5mhrv708j

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #163 on: February 15, 2010, 08:36:03 PM »
I will believe it when I see it fly. Virgin Galactic has put a really bad taste in everyone's mouth when it comes to "commercial spaceflight". Making money is one thing. Ripping people for $250,000 US for a ride in a cannonball is completely useless. Take a ride on Zero-G. It lasts longer and costs around $5,000. You get the same thing.

If any company were really serious about "commercial spaceflight" then one of them would get OV-105 after NASA has finished with it, and keep using it at least until 2014. That is when the current OMDP certifications run out. OV-103 has a ticket until 2012, while OV-104 has already flown past the expiration date. But not one company has expressed interest. Why?

Well at last accounting, the average cost of a shuttle mission was over $600 million US. Some estimates by opponents say $1.5bn. Proponents say $300 million, By those figures it costs between $5,750 and $28,100 per pound/half-kg to LEO. Most ELV costs are around $5,100 to $15,500 perlb/.5kg. However all the ELV can do is loft it up there. Without a capability like the STS, that is about all one can do.

One thing most people don't take into account is that the "commercial launch market" collapsed. And now, well last September, Obama started the final countdown to NASA's demise.

http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1493/1

Looks like China is getting some help from NASA and Obama is behind it.

Like I said, I am ashamed of America. I can only hope the change in Congress will save our collective butts. But we all know con is the opposite of pro...

So Congress must be the opposite of Progress.

What founding father missed this glaring mistake?

Moonwalker

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Re: Ares 1X
« Reply #164 on: February 16, 2010, 12:10:13 AM »
Virgin Galactic and SpaceX are two different companies. Virgin Galactic intentions is space tourism, still flying ballistically within the earths atmosphere. SpaceX is a serious space engineering company capable to send satallites into LEO, as well as cargo and humans to the ISS. That's why NASA has made a contract with SpaceX of 1.6 billion USD. The most sucessful company currently is Arianespace by the way, with more than 1 billion USD revenue per year. I guess everyone knows their Ariane 5 rocket operated by ESA (yes it's commercial and it works). In thise league (SpaceX and Arianespace), Virgin Galactic does not play any role at all, nor is it comparable. It's like trying to compare apples and pears. Commercial does not stand for tourism or non-governmental funded. It's just a different method to distribute money for serious space flight engineering.

As for the Space Shuttle: the Space Shuttle requires a huge and expensive infrastructure which only NASA has. There is no company which has such an infrastructure (consisting of several companies, space centers and facilities), the required know how and most importantly the required money to operate something like the Space Shuttle. The launch cost is ~1.5 billion USD. But most importantly there is no rational reason at all, neither for NASA nor for somebody else, to operate the Shuttle any further just for the sake of some fan-boys (which I am as well) to see it continue to fly and be happy. The reason for the Shuttle retirement beside aging is its risky design flaw and the massive costs. The only reason the Shuttle survived after STS-107 is NASA's commitment to use it for ISS assembly. Without the ISS in Orbit, STS-107 would have been the last flight of the STS program. Whilst with potential issues during the last Hubble servicing mission, that would have been the end as well even in case the ISS would not have been finished, as had been pointed out by the managers. The Shuttle operates on its final breaths technologially and costly. Not even Roscosmos would be interested to operate that money hungry brick.

As for China: the whole Chinese space program gets totally overestimated. Their program is not in a good shape (only 3 manned flights within nearly a decade and "0" science whilst they intend to fly into space manned for more than 4 decades already). China does not get any help. China is not an evil communist country that tries to be the king of the universe. There seems to be some mistaken enemy images by some people these days. China can be lucky if they manage to get more experience in space anytime in the future.

The leaders in space are, and will continue to be: NASA, ESA, and Roscosmos (and its smaller partners around the globe). They'll work together like they already do, and more commercial companies (beside Arianespace) will join.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2010, 12:20:56 AM by Moonwalker »