Had dinner with two Shuttle astronauts and talked about SSM2007

[Greggy_D]

A few weeks ago, I had the pleasure of dining with Charlie Walker (41-D, 51-D, 61-B) and Rick Searfoss (STS-58, 76, 90) in San Diego, CA.  Rick Searfoss sat directly to my right.

The discussion initially centered on my failed attempt of becoming a USAF pilot in 1988.  I was medically bounced out after my flight physical due to a skin condition called "eczema".  All pilot/astronaut dreams were shattered at that point.  Charlie started talking about Flight Simulators and I ran with it.

I indicated that, yes, I fly ANY simulator on the PC but one in particular has my interest now.  I then detailed SSM2007 for both Charlie and Rick.  You should have seen the look on their faces.  They appeared ASTOUNDED that a program like this exists.

Rick Searfoss flew on both Atlantis and Columbia.  I asked him if there was any flight characteristic differences between the two since Columbia is heavier.  He indicated that Columbia has a CG closer to the nose versus Atlantis because of the weight.

Rick indicated that, "Columbia requires a constant back pressure on the stick during approach and landing. Hint hint SSM2007 team.  He also indicated they can set up the Shuttle Training Aircraft (STA) with the characteristics of Columbia and Atlantis separately.  He said comparing the two, "Atlantis was EASY!".

He also indicated that the handling was the same for both Shuttles while on orbit due to the computer control.  I then asked him about ITEM 24, 25, and 26 and he replied, "You know that? You're giving me nightmares because it's bringing back memories of training."

All in all, I think both astronauts were amazed that a $50 program could replicate the "real deal".

[USA~Driver]

  You should have seen the look on their faces. 

Well, I will. When you invite me the next time you decide to dine with REAL ASTRONAUTS. 

Great story. But sorry to hear about the Air Force thing. 

[JLM]

Did they bombard you with questions about SSM 2007?

[Admin]

A few weeks ago, I had the pleasure of dining with Charlie Walker (41-D, 51-D, 61-B) and Rick Searfoss (STS-58, 76, 90) in San Diego, CA.  Rick Searfoss sat directly to my right.

...SNIP>...

All in all, I think both astronauts were amazed that a $50 program could replicate the "real deal".

thanks for the story Greggy_D!

If you can notice, since SP 3.00 we simulate Atlantis' and more recent flight characteristics. Before SP 3.00 you had to constantly pull on the stick to keep the nose up during approach & landing. That is gone now. We've decided to go for the current behavior instead and after seeing how much more pleasant it is, we won't go back to the old Columbia nose-heavy model. Great timing to raise the subject though 

And THANK YOU for evangelizing SSM2007 with the guys - I hope we'll have two more nuts flying it (you did give them the URL, didn't you  ), although from their "Oh no! Not ITEM 24, 25 again!" reaction, I doubt it! 

/Admin

[Greggy_D]

Did they bombard you with questions about SSM 2007?

It was a two-way street.  We were both bouncing the various modes off of each other.  Remember, it's been over 10 years since Rick flew so he has forgotten a LOT of the GPC commands.  He was amazed that the program contained so much detail for $50.  AND.....he didn't get to see the stupendous graphics.  I wish I had my laptop with me at that moment to let him test drive it.

Honestly, he's happy leaving his Shuttle memories behind.  He's currently flying for Xcor, which will take private citizens into space within the next two years.  Current cost: $95,000 but he said that should come down to $25,000-$35,000 about 5 years after they start flying regularly.  Xcor's plan is to have 3 flights daily with Rick as your pilot.

[marvx]

Very interesting Greggy!

/Marvx

[Spacewalker]

If you can notice, since SP 3.00 we simulate Atlantis' and more recent flight characteristics. Before SP 3.00 you had to constantly pull on the stick to keep the nose up during approach & landing. That is gone now. We've decided to go for the current behavior instead and after seeing how much more pleasant it is, we won't go back to the old Columbia nose-heavy model.

As I understand it, this is not a question of "old flight characteristics against more recent flight characteristics". It is more about the differences between each individual vehicle: e.g. Atlantis was less nose-heavy than Columbia already from the beginning, so, it required less back-pressure on the stick already from the first flight on.
So, actually, the flight characteristics of Columbia should be modeled different from Atlantis'. I am not sure how difficult this would be to implement in the sim. But since we had the nose-heavy flight model before SP 3.00, and now we have the flight model with the CG further aft, I figure that you have the program routines for both flight models available. So, I guess, the question would be, how to tell the sim, when it should use which routine to model the correct flight characteristics for the actually simulated vehicle in the mission at hand.
Also, I don't know how the flight characteristics of the other shuttles should be modeled correctly. I can imagine that Discovery and Endeavour are similar to Atlantis, but I don't know about Challenger. But I am sure, there are some people at NASA who know.

[KDelande]

I sat next to Rick Searfoss on a flight from Las Vegas to Chicago a few years ago.  A very friendly gentleman, once we engaged on space/NASA speak, it was a quick flight.  Still have the business card he gave me.

Very memorable encounter with a terrific guy.

KD

[Bat502]

If they did decide to buy it would they get the 3 key install policy or would they be given a unique key to install as many times as possible? Sorry only joking. Just couldn't help it.

[gablau]

A few weeks ago, I had the pleasure of dining with Charlie Walker (41-D, 51-D, 61-B) and Rick Searfoss (STS-58, 76, 90) in San Diego, CA.  Rick Searfoss sat directly to my right.

...SNIP>...

All in all, I think both astronauts were amazed that a $50 program could replicate the "real deal".

thanks for the story Greggy_D!

And THANK YOU for evangelizing SSM2007 with the guys - I hope we'll have two more nuts flying it (you did give them the URL, didn't you  ),

/Admin

How about sending them a free copy? Imagine the business you guys would get if a real astronaut (even if a former real astronaut) would install the program on his computer and like it.

[Greggy_D]

As I said, a lot of former astronauts want to leave that "world" behind.  They've moved on to the next journey in their life. 

Most likely a case of "been there, done that", which Rick indicated was one of the reason he retired from NASA after his third flight.  Ox vanHoften thought the same.  He flew on two of the most interesting/challenging flights ever (41-C and 51-I).  He thought in his head, "How am I going to top those two missions?  I'm not, plus I can't raise a family on this piddly astronaut pay.......time to go."

I know it's hard for us simmers to comprehend because we think we could fly hundreds of times on the shuttle and not get sick of it.  There are many other factors involved besides the "WOW" factor of flight.

[asterix]

As I said, a lot of former astronauts want to leave that "world" behind.  They've moved on to the next journey in their life. 
Most likely a case of "been there, done that".....
I know it's hard for us simmers to comprehend because we think we could fly hundreds of times on the shuttle and not get sick of it.  There are many other factors involved besides the "WOW" factor of flight.

I don't necessarily think that's true.

I spent nearly 20 years serving on submarines and still love playing submarine sims even now. Just because I don't do it anymore nor want to doesn't mean that I've lost interest in them. My bones and joints can't handle it anymore but I will always be a submariner. I believe that astronauts would have similar feelings. Neither of them are your ordinary run of the mill careers.

[Admin]

As I said, a lot of former astronauts want to leave that "world" behind.  They've moved on to the next journey in their life. 
Most likely a case of "been there, done that".....
I know it's hard for us simmers to comprehend because we think we could fly hundreds of times on the shuttle and not get sick of it.  There are many other factors involved besides the "WOW" factor of flight.

I don't necessarily think that's true.

I spent nearly 20 years serving on submarines and still love playing submarine sims even now. Just because I don't do it anymore nor want to doesn't mean that I've lost interest in them. My bones and joints can't handle it anymore but I will always be a submariner. I believe that astronauts would have similar feelings. Neither of them are your ordinary run of the mill careers.

Well, "dif'rent strokes"...

For a subjective account of how ex-Astros may feel, dig Mullane's "Riding Rockets" book (link in the media secion below).



/Admin

[asterix]

Well, dif'rent strokes, horses for courses etc. Fair enough.

Have heard a few good comments about this book, its definately on my "must get" list, just not got round to it.

(I've taken the liberty of assuming you weren't referring to that awful sitcom around the late 70's / early 80's. "wotchu talkin' about Willis?"  ) 

[Admin]

Well, dif'rent strokes, horses for courses etc. Fair enough.

Have heard a few good comments about this book, its definately on my "must get" list, just not got round to it.

(I've taken the liberty of assuming you weren't referring to that awful sitcom around the late 70's / early 80's. "wotchu talkin' about Willis?"  ) 

OF COURSE not, asterix - LOL! You've got it right the first time

/Admin